PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

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Re: PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

Postby boldblade » 03 Jul 2018, 19:56

Sounds familiar... I seem to remember subbing a bad Turkey spot and trying to throw to the most powerful player on the board when no one would give me a chance at more. Seems recent just can't remember exactly what happened.
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Re: PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

Postby boldblade » 03 Jul 2018, 19:57

mhsmith0 wrote:
I can't help that one, I was asked and hemmed and hawed and then said yes. I'd have been fine if anyone else particularly wanted the spot; had you contacted mjparett to ask to sub in?

I did but he ignored my message! The nerve!

Truthfully I think you did the right thing. Still a pure sham though! :twisted:
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Re: PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

Postby jay65536 » 03 Jul 2018, 20:00

Wow, so just a total breakdown...very surprising.

Did you at least try to re-open communications with England after France went to the Channel in S11? Because I saw that and thought "this is going to be a dogfight", not "this is over already".
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Re: PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

Postby mhsmith0 » 03 Jul 2018, 20:01

boldblade wrote:Sounds familiar... I seem to remember subbing a bad Turkey spot and trying to throw to the most powerful player on the board when no one would give me a chance at more. Seems recent just can't remember exactly what happened.

lol

in my defense, when i tried to throw the solo to France in this game I was also trying to worm my way back into the result, but since England shut down communication entirely I didn't care to work to reopen it (in particular with London just a wide open conquest for France, i don't understand at all how England isn't at least going to talk to everyone else and cover bases *shrugs*)

had England wanted to talk, I'd have tried to work back into the result

and when I was Russia in our game together, that was what I feared (in particular, I feared that IF could join hands with you or Germany and then I'd lose altogether). Possibly overly much, but so it goes. I'll also note that I was pretty engaged with my discussions with France and kept working on making sure she was as comfortable with the risk she was taking as possible, talking through options, giving move suggestions, explicitly saying "ok I'm just flat-out giving you this center", etc
Also even without my explicit help, she probably solo's just from working on it in that turn; like, ABSOLUTE worst case she's looking at like 15 centers, she has dominance over ION, she'll eventually crack my home centers, etc.

I feel like that was a REALLY easy solo spot for her. Maybe it was easier for me than I'd counted on, but I didn't think so, and so it goes *shrugs*
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Re: PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

Postby Pootleflump » 03 Jul 2018, 20:02

jay65536 wrote:I was all set to decry the carebear draw, but then I saw the result--this is either a total breakdown (which seems unlikely from an outsider's perspective) or the biggest carebear meta-gaming result I've ever seen. Only once before have I ever seen such total lack of fight in an endgame.

Anyway, now that the game is over, my point was, as of Fall 1908, when the replacement Turkey took over, France appeared to have a losing position, and instead she went on to win.


Hey. Congratulations Pootle. Maybe you just played a decent game of diplomacy and managed to get other people to do what you wanted them to and steered the game to the ending it was. 'Carebear Metagaming' gee thanks.
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Re: PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

Postby boldblade » 03 Jul 2018, 20:04

Don't try to defend it. It's indefensible.
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Re: PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

Postby mhsmith0 » 03 Jul 2018, 20:06

jay65536 wrote:Wow, so just a total breakdown...very surprising.

Did you at least try to re-open communications with England after France went to the Channel in S11? Because I saw that and thought "this is going to be a dogfight", not "this is over already".


I didn't bother tbh. I'd already been stabbed multiple times by him in a short period of time (I consider the earlier Sev move to be a stab, I just couldn't really do anything about it at the time), and I was the weaker power with far less to lose. I feel like in that spot, it's England's responsibility to come to the table. If he didn't feel like doing so, well, that's a choice, and that has consequences. I wasn't willing at all to be a patsy just so EF could grow together and make a carebear result possible, so he'd really need to work to convince me, rather than the other way around. As far as I was concerned, his communications to me were tldr "I don't want to talk to you, and I'm fully committed to France". Why would I want/need/feel obliged to reach out to him at that point? He shut down communications, which was a purposeful decision, even though France was well ahead of him with stab potential and neither myself nor Germany (I think) had been talking to him, and even though I'd basically publicly said I was "going for a new plan" (which based on our lack of communications clearly didn't include him), and even though France made MULTIPLE moves in the spring that seemed to set up a stab (taking Kiel, and walking into ENG which gave her a shot at London).
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Re: PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

Postby boldblade » 03 Jul 2018, 20:07

Pootleflump wrote:
jay65536 wrote:I was all set to decry the carebear draw, but then I saw the result--this is either a total breakdown (which seems unlikely from an outsider's perspective) or the biggest carebear meta-gaming result I've ever seen. Only once before have I ever seen such total lack of fight in an endgame.

Anyway, now that the game is over, my point was, as of Fall 1908, when the replacement Turkey took over, France appeared to have a losing position, and instead she went on to win.


Hey. Congratulations Pootle. Maybe you just played a decent game of diplomacy and managed to get other people to do what you wanted them to and steered the game to the ending it was. 'Carebear Metagaming' gee thanks.

To be fair I think he has backtracked on that a little. I think he might agree with what I am about to say.

I think you did great. I think other players made some terrible decisions. And Jimbob/admins still turned this into a sham. But remember the first five words of this paragraph are most important.
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Re: PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

Postby mhsmith0 » 03 Jul 2018, 20:07

boldblade wrote:
mhsmith0 wrote:
I can't help that one, I was asked and hemmed and hawed and then said yes. I'd have been fine if anyone else particularly wanted the spot; had you contacted mjparett to ask to sub in?

I did but he ignored my message! The nerve!

Truthfully I think you did the right thing. Still a pure sham though! :twisted:


Well I take no responsibility for you not getting the spot :P

I was kinda like "eh, I'm kinda busy, and the position I'm taking over sucks, but sure I'll take it since league has been fun so I don't mind" *shrugs*
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Re: PDL - Round 3 viewers lounge

Postby boldblade » 03 Jul 2018, 20:12

mhsmith0 wrote:Well I take no responsibility for you not getting the spot :P

I was kinda like "eh, I'm kinda busy, and the position I'm taking over sucks, but sure I'll take it since league has been fun so I don't mind" *shrugs*

Can I just blame you anyways? Stokes our rivalry and rivalries are good for th league.
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