Scoring System for Second PDL Season

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Scoring System for Second PDL Season

Postby Shyvve » 24 Mar 2018, 21:48

Folks,
I would like to propose a new scoring system for the second PDL season. IMO, we have too heavily nerfed the incentive for solos with our current system. Plus, the system I'm proposing would have a fixed total sum of points for each game (except in the case of a solo which would be assigned a higher value than twice the score a player would receive for a two-way draw). The base number of points, which in the event of a drawn game would be split equally among those in a draw, is 60 points.
However, in the case of anything less than a 5-way draw, I propose a pretty drastic reduction in the total number of points per player (which basically means the base number of points for those games drops from 60 points to only 30 points for a 5WD; and to only a 7 points base for a seven-way draw).

Not that 6WD or 7WD need much dis-incentivizing, but, there you have it.

I also suggest that we increase the penalty for surrenders to -10 points to scale things.

Here is what I'm suggesting:
Solo = 70 pts for the soloist
2WD = 30 pts/player
3WD = 20 pts/player
4WD = 15 pts/player
5WD = 12 pts/player
6WD = 5 pts/player
7WD = 1 pt/player
surrender = -10 pts

I wanted to get this suggestion out relatively early so that we can begin tossing ideas around if other folks see a need to revamp our current scoring system.

For any proposal to be put to a vote by the League members, it must first receive more than 10 League members' approval for the exact proposal specified. It then gets put to a secret ballot requiring a minimum of 2/3 votes in favor. Here is the pertinent info on new proposals being enacted: viewtopic.php?f=816&t=56606

EDIT: Changed the reward for a solo from 75 points to 70 points.

Those in favor of proposal (3)
: Shyvve, The SHIV, Don Juan of Austria
Last edited by Shyvve on 25 Mar 2018, 20:12, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Scoring System for Second PDL Season

Postby V » 24 Mar 2018, 22:14

Scoring systems all have a great feature (there the same for everyone:-). If solos are being deterred by what we have (11% so far, 1 in 9) then a change in that direction could be good. Is PlayDip’s usual solo rate >11%? We should have a representative sample by rnd 3or4 to implement change, if there is a solo shortage demonstrated at that time.
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Re: Scoring System for Second PDL Season

Postby Don Juan of Austria » 24 Mar 2018, 22:28

V wrote:Scoring systems all have a great feature (there the same for everyone:-). If solos are being deterred by what we have (11% so far, 1 in 9) then a change in that direction could be good. Is PlayDip’s usual solo rate >11%? We should have a representative sample by rnd 3or4 to implement change, if there is a solo shortage demonstrated at that time.


From what I hear, PlayDip usually has a higher solo rate...
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Re: Scoring System for Second PDL Season

Postby Shyvve » 24 Mar 2018, 22:29

For "Standard" Games I'm seeing this:
Total number of completed games: 29311
Total number of solo victories: 14075 (48%)
Total number of 2-way draws: 6136
Total number of 3-way draws: 6662
Total number of 4-way draws: 2122

For "Classic" Games this:
Total number of games on site: 82245
All other details are for RANKED games only
Total number of completed games: 35816
Total number of solo victories: 18580 (52%)
Total number of 2-way draws: 6842
Total number of 3-way draws: 7588
Total number of 4-way draws: 2428

*I am unsure what the difference is now between Classic and Standard. Even though WHS kindly explained the difference to me once! I just can't recall the distinction at the moment. Maybe all Classic games aren't full comms? Or, all Classic games aren't ranked?
I've also heard it stated that our solo rate onsite might be inflated wrt a F2F environment (surrenders?).
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Re: Scoring System for Second PDL Season

Postby V » 24 Mar 2018, 22:37

Remarkable (around 50%!)
Doubt we’ll achieve that in PDL & a few more could be welcome next year, if we settle at one per round this year.
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Re: Scoring System for Second PDL Season

Postby The SHIV » 25 Mar 2018, 00:40

I can't believe the solo rate is around 50%.

I have no idea what the scoring system is now except you all surrender and The SHIV wins!

But I do like the Shyvves scoring system so I vote yes.

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Re: Scoring System for Second PDL Season

Postby Don Juan of Austria » 25 Mar 2018, 08:42

The SHIV wrote:I can't believe the solo rate is around 50%.

I have no idea what the scoring system is now except you all surrender and The SHIV wins!

But I do like the Shyvves scoring system so I vote yes.

The SHIV


Pretty much the same thoughts as The Shiv... No idea what the current method is, but I like Shyvve's new one....as I can understand it. ;)
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Re: Scoring System for Second PDL Season

Postby duckling » 25 Mar 2018, 10:54

Isn't this just going to work against more solo's?

In your normal fight for a ranking, it's an endless battle towards an"infinite" goal. The only way to "win" is to make it as big as possible. You have to constantly be ahead.
In a tournament or series, you´re fighting to be first in a very limited field over very limited time.

Each player has an incentive to solo, but also an incentive to prevent others from soloing.
So if a solo gives a player a good jump ahead, that means everybody else on the board has an increased incentive to go for a draw, and prevent the solo.

What are the chances of solos in other leagues / tournaments in general? I don't know. I would think the chance of a solo should be lower than in regular rank play, because your chances of catching up are smaller.

The significance of the fixed number of points per game I don't understand (your system doesn't stick to it, anyway..). Is this affecting things in any way that has to be factored in?
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Re: Scoring System for Second PDL Season

Postby mjparrett » 25 Mar 2018, 11:47

Hi all. Thought I'd chip in here.

As people might remember - I have no massive preference on the scoring system. It is, after all, the same for everyone. I agree with duckling that this might make anti-leader alliances a little quicker to form; the one solo will probably win the league.

If you can get 10 agrees, I'll put it to vote - but as I saw when I started the league for every agree you will have someone who has is own idea. The scoring system might not be currently perfect but it works well enough, and is not the thing that causes the most problems (fixtures not being as efficient as they could be and resignations).

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Re: Scoring System for Second PDL Season

Postby Shyvve » 25 Mar 2018, 20:09

Thanks for the feedback, folks.

I'm probably just splitting hairs here. Using 60 points as a game's base value just kinda stuck in my head the other day (divisible by 2-6), rather than 40 points.
Our current system is this:
Solo = 40 points
2 way draw = 20 points
3 way draw = 10 points
4 way draw = 5 points
5 way draw = 2 points
6 and 7 way draw = 0 points
Surrender = -5 points.

So, as the draw size increases, each member of the draw's reward is basically halved (and the total base points for the game decreases by 10). 6WD and 7WD are completely discounted, which is fine. The system I proposed assigns a minimal reward to 6- or 7WD's and also decreases the base points value to 30 pts for a 6WD and 7 pts for a 7WD. A quibble though, how many 6- or 7WD's do we ever see?
When the League was being developed, I seem to recall there was a good bit of discussion about how to bump up the incentives for 2WD's vs the more common 3WD or 4WD's.
I 'think' the solution we adopted was to make 2WD's worth half as much as a solo; instead of solos being worth twice as much as a "2WD + an additional reward."

By adopting a scoring system like the one I proposed, we're kinda going back to incentivizing solos. Yes, and especially with only a four-game season as duckling points out, the incentive to form SLA's will rise. But also will the reward increase for a player to take a chance and go for it.
I'm one of those who thinks that (barring surrenders, incompetence) that almost all solos can be prevented. Sometimes they are not because of kingmaking or just too much bad blood persisting amongst former rivals and the SLA doesn't get to where it needs to get quick enough.
Disclaimer: one look at my stats will tell you I know little about soloing, :lol:

But, for the most common draw types (2,3,4,5WD's), my system keeps the base points for the game constant. This may or may not be of much significance, ymmv.

TL;DR-I'll leave the proposal out there and will keep the tally of those in favor current.

Oh, and as Mike stated. Yeah, the main problems we're experiencing are resignations and perhaps optimizing the fixtures a bit better. I hope that new players (either those that didn't get to join this first season or those that haven't found PDL yet; or are entirely new to the site) come along and join us for Season 2.
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