Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

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Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

Postby connect4 » 09 Mar 2014, 05:16

Proposal 307: Regarding Currency

  1. In Nomic 5, there is a game relevant concept known as currency.
  2. All current currency will always be tracked in the appropriate Nomic 5 scoreboard thread.
  3. Points are a unit of currency.
  4. If a player becomes inactive, and later returns to the game, they retain their currency.
  5. Currency may be transferred to another player. The procedure to do this is as follows:
    1. The transfer must be posted in the current proposal thread in orange (orange is defined as #FF8000), with size 125 or greater so as to enable tracking in the Tabulator. The post must be made during the Proposal Phase or the Voting Phase.
    2. Transfers must clearly state the recipient, the quantity of the transfer (including the type of currency being transfered), and optionally a condition for that player’s vote. If there is a condition specified in the transfer, it may only be dependent on the final vote cast by the recipient for the current turn (e.g. “I transfer 3 points to asudevil”).
    3. The quantity of the transfer must be a positive integer between 1 and 10, inclusive. This clause is narfable.
    4. The unit of the transfer must be a unit defined in this game by a current rule or Thing.
    5. A player may make at most two transfers during a turn. This clause is narfable.
    6. For each unit of currency, the sum of all transfers made during a turn must be less than or equal to the number of units of that currency the player had at the start of the turn. This clause is narfable.
    7. Once posted, a transfer may not be withdrawn.
    8. Transfers will be processed at the end of the Voting Phase.
Last edited by connect4 on 09 Mar 2014, 17:01, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

Postby connect4 » 09 Mar 2014, 05:18

Thing:

Bookie’s Book
Possession: Upon creation, the Bookie’s Book will be possessed by Crunkus.
Flow: At the start of a proposal phase, the Bookie’s Book is transferred automatically to the active player whose turn is scheduled to come next in the turn order.
Legacy: If the player possessing the Bookie’s Book becomes inactive, it will transfer to the active player whose turn is scheduled to come next in the turn order.
Title: The possessor of the Bookie’s Book is referred to as “the House”.
Protection: The Bookie's Book is Protected.
Opening Betting: The House must open betting for the turn by opening a betting line. The procedure for this is as follows:
  1. The House will open betting in a post by writing the betting line on its own line, in size 125 or greater, and in the color green (defined as #008000).
  2. The betting line must be opened during the Proposal Phase. If the Proposal Phase is ended early by the proposer and the House has not made a post to the thread, then the betting line must be opened in the House’s first post during the voting phase.
  3. A failure to open the betting line will result in a loss of 10 points for the House.
  4. The format of the betting line is one of the following:
    1. OVER/UNDER: The betting line will be “OVER/UNDER: [CONDITION]”. The condition must specify a number of votes, and type. For example: “OVER/UNDER: 3 RED AYE VOTES”.
    2. PASS/FAIL: The betting line will be “PASS/FAIL: [VOTETYPE]”, where VOTETYPE specifies the election. For example: “PASS/FAIL: PROPOSAL 307”..
    3. YES/NO: The betting line will be “YES/NO: [PLAYER] WILL VOTE [VOTE] FOR [VOTETYPE].” Player is the player being referred to, Vote is the vote they will vote, and Votetype is the election in which the player casts a vote. For example, “bob.durf will vote AYE for the Thing”. The House may not select himself as the player for this betting line.
Placing Bets: After the betting line has been opened, and prior to the end of the Voting Phase, each player may place a single bet. The format of this bet will be “[CHOICE] [CURRENCY]”, where CHOICE is the player’s selection, and CURRENCY is a positive integer units of a legal currency in the game between 1 and 10, inclusive. The bet must be placed on its own line, with size 125 or greater, and in the color green (#008000). A bet that does not specify one of the two applicable bet types will be considered invalid, and not processed. Example bets for each type are as follows (assuming dollars are a legal form of currency):
  1. OVER/UNDER Example: OVER 8 points
  2. PASS/FAIL Example: PASS 3 dollars
  3. YES/NO Example: NO 2 points
Bet Resolution: at the start of the Adjudication Phase, the player who posts the results will also resolve bets. The resolution is as follows:
  1. OVER/UNDER: If more than the specified number of votes are cast for the specified condition, then all OVER bets are winning bets, and all UNDER bets are losing bets. If fewer than the specified number of votes are cast for the specified condition, then all UNDER bets are winning bets, and all OVER bets are losing bets. If the condition is met exactly (OVER/UNDER 3 RED AYE VOTES), then all bets are losing bets.
  2. PASS/FAIL: If the vote specified passes, then all PASS bets are winning bets, and all FAIL bets are losing bets. Otherwise, all FAIL bets are winning bets, and all PASS bets are losing bets.
  3. YES/NO: if the player specified in the bet bets as specified, all YES bets will be winning bets, and all NO bets will be losing bets. Otherwise, all NO bets will be winning bets, and all YES bets will be losing bets.
  4. All winning bets will be resolved by the player gaining the currency wagered, and the House losing the same amount of currency. Losing bets will be resolved by the house gaining the currency wagered, and the player losing the currency.
Last edited by connect4 on 10 Mar 2014, 02:56, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

Postby connect4 » 09 Mar 2014, 05:22

Justification: More to come later, but point flow will allow us to play more nicely. I tried to write 307 to be more general, to allow not just point flow, but also (insert other unit here) flow, for later on in the game when we start having other trackable quantities in play. That essentially enables trades later of "I trade 5 points to SD for an Alice Point" if both players make transfers. (I shudder to type that sentence...)

As for why you can make a trade, even if you're in the red: felt this would make the proposal less complicated, allowing for more action. I am certainly open to wording it so that a player may only make positive offers of points.

The Bookie's Book is there to make the game interesting. Makes a player decide a bet, and it's got to be good, or he's losing a lot of points...

Wording for anything above would be glad to be updated. I'm very poor at initial wording.
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Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

Postby Zoomzip » 09 Mar 2014, 05:26

Thought the first-- like the ideas here. But... One could open a yes/no house vote on the house's vote, and hedge against outcomes since the house controls the outcome?
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Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

Postby connect4 » 09 Mar 2014, 06:20

Zoomzip wrote:Thought the first-- like the ideas here. But... One could open a yes/no house vote on the house's vote, and hedge against outcomes since the house controls the outcome?


Good call ZZ. Added in a sentence stating that the house cannot be the player referred to in YES/NO.
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Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

Postby super_dipsy » 09 Mar 2014, 08:20

I love it! (except the implied criticism of dear Alice ;) )

A few points.

Placing Bets: After the betting line has been opened, and prior to the end of the Voting Phase, a player may place a single bet.

This is a bit ambiguous or at least open to interpretation. Do you mean one player'? Or each player? I suspect you mean everyone gets to make one bet (sorry to be a bit pedantic, but it would be sad to see someone arguing that 'a' means singular if that is not what you intended.

The player making the transfer must have a positive number of units of the transferred currency at the start of the turn.

I wonder if it would be better to say a player must have sufficient units to cover the bet? As written, if I have +1 point I can transfer 10 points to Connect4. Or is that what you intended? If so, I am not sure why the restriction to starting with a +ve number.
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Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

Postby Crunkus » 09 Mar 2014, 14:34

Could we get an example listed under "placing bets" as well?

This broadens the game quite a bit. I like it.
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Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

Postby Crunkus » 09 Mar 2014, 14:40

Could we get a couple of narfable clauses? I'd prefer:

  • The quantity of the transfer must be a positive integer between 1 and 10, inclusive. This clause is narfable.
  • A player may make at most two transfers during a turn. This clause is narfable.
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Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

Postby Crunkus » 09 Mar 2014, 14:49

Also could we get a clause that specifies that currency is always retained when a player goes inactive until such time as they become active again? Or some such?
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Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 307 - Currency / Bookie's Book

Postby connect4 » 09 Mar 2014, 16:44

super_dipsy wrote:I love it! (except the implied criticism of dear Alice ;) )

A few points.

Placing Bets: After the betting line has been opened, and prior to the end of the Voting Phase, a player may place a single bet.

This is a bit ambiguous or at least open to interpretation. Do you mean one player'? Or each player? I suspect you mean everyone gets to make one bet (sorry to be a bit pedantic, but it would be sad to see someone arguing that 'a' means singular if that is not what you intended.

The player making the transfer must have a positive number of units of the transferred currency at the start of the turn.

I wonder if it would be better to say a player must have sufficient units to cover the bet? As written, if I have +1 point I can transfer 10 points to Connect4. Or is that what you intended? If so, I am not sure why the restriction to starting with a +ve number.


Apologies on phone trying to rock an overtired infant.

Part 1 was poor wording. Everyone should get 1 bet. Wording to be fixed later.

Part 2: was originally concerned about wording for multiple transfers (if I start turn with 10 points and transfer 10 to you, i still have 10 until end of voting phase so I can offer some to crunkus). I have a better fix in mind (transfer is from one to 10, but total transfers must be less than or equal to cureency at start of turn). Will fix later after part.
Crunk, I like your ideas; will comment more later.
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