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Re: Nomiic 5 Proposal 304 - Stalin's Stamp

PostPosted: 02 Mar 2014, 03:31
by Crunkus_old
connect4 wrote:size=150]color=#FF0000]AYE/color]
color=#0000BF]AYE/color]/size]

I think I got that right on my phone.


Colour and size codes editted to reveal actual codes.
For the record, that blue vote is not legal under rule 302.

Rule 302, clause I:1-3 wrote:
  1. Thing creation can be initiated by the proposer during the proposal phase. This clause is narfable.
    1. To initiate the creation of a Thing, the creator must not have already initiated the creation of a Thing this turn, and must post to the proposal thread a post that includes:
    2. The name of the Thing on its own line, in blue color and at least size 125; conditional Thing initiation of creation is not allowed. Blue will be defined to be the color #0000FF. This clause is narfable.
    3. A list of all the proposed properties of The Thing.

Re: Nomiic 5 Proposal 304 - Stalin's Stamp

PostPosted: 02 Mar 2014, 03:35
by Crunkus_old
Pagane wrote:I like that this now revolves around the 3/4th vs majority issue. Good call, Dipsy.

size=150]color=#FF0000]AYE/color]
color=#0000BF]AYE/color][size]


This blue vote is also illegal.

Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 304 - Stalin's Stamp

PostPosted: 02 Mar 2014, 03:49
by Crunkus_old
Now that all votes have are in, I'll post the results:

The voting period has ended.

Connect4 - AYE, No vote on Stalin's Stamp
Crunkus - AYE, AYE on Stalin's Stamp (illegal vote)
Pagane - -AYE, No vote on Stalin's Stamp (illegal vote)
super_dipsy - AYE, No vote on Stalin's Stamp (ineligible)
Ugluk - 0 - NAY, NAY on Stalin's Stamp

Proposal 304, passes. 4 Ayes, 1 Nay. (4/5)
Among those eligible to vote for the Thing: Stalin's Stamp, there is one AYE, and one NAY. Stalin's Stamp is not created.

Having succeded in reaching a 3/4ths majority, Proposal 303 passes.

super-dipsy gains (4/5) * (304-291) = 12 points for votes cast on the proposal.
super-dipsy initiated a proposed thing, and lost the vote to get it created and loses 5 points under rule 303-K3 = -5
super-dipsy included the mention of at least narfable clause = 1

12-5+1 = +8 points total for super-dipsy

Ugluk is up.

Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 304 - Stalin's Stamp

PostPosted: 02 Mar 2014, 04:09
by connect4
Blah, remind me to not copy the wrong vote next time... :)

Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 304 - Stalin's Stamp

PostPosted: 02 Mar 2014, 05:24
by Ugluk
On it.

Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 304 - Stalin's Stamp

PostPosted: 02 Mar 2014, 07:06
by super_dipsy
I am requesting a judgement from Judge Pagane on whether it is acceptable to count the votes for Stalin's Stamp that were made in the wrong form of blue. I would maintain that the intention was clear and that the votes should therefore count, particularly since C4s vote was copied from a previous one due to having to work on a phone :)

I humbly ask Judge Pagane to rule that the bkue votes that were in the wrong colour specification should still count.

Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 304 - Stalin's Stamp

PostPosted: 02 Mar 2014, 07:26
by Pagane
Ouch, I've been rushing around so much of late that I've thrown all attention to detail out the window.

Regarding the votes for Stalin's Stamp:
Rule 302, Section K wrote:During the Voting phase, any player who did not initiate the creation of the Thing being voted on who is also active may vote on the proposed creation of the Thing.
Votes relevant to Thing creation must be cast on their own line, in blue color and at least size 125; conditional votes are not allowed. Blue will be defined to be the color #0000FF. This clause is narfable.
Acceptable text for votes are as follows:
AYE
NAY
ABSTAIN
ABSTAIN, in this context, is the published decision not to vote on the creation of the THING.


Blue is clearly defined to be the color #0000FF. As much as I want to allow for the obvious intent expressed by myself and by Connect4, I cannot rule in favor of the passage of Stalin's Stamp.

Rule 304 is passed, but the Thing known as Stalin's Stamp is not created.

Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 304 - Stalin's Stamp (judgement request

PostPosted: 02 Mar 2014, 07:38
by super_dipsy
I beg your pardon, I have erred.

Sorry Pagane, I dragged you into this incorrectly. Since it is clear we are playing this game precisely according to the written rules, you are not in fact the Judge. My bad.

Rule 301 wrote:Adjudication Phase

Any player may post the results for the round once the voting phase ends. That player must include whether the proposal passes or fails, and an updated scoreboard with all points awarded from that round. When that post is made, the turn ends, and the next turn begins.


My turn ended when Crunkus made his post.

212. If players disagree about the legality of a move or the interpretation or application of a rule, then the active player preceding the player who began the turn in which the disagreement arose is to be the Judge and decide the question. Disagreement for the purposes of this rule may be created by the insistence of any player. This process is called invoking Judgment.


So, according to rule 301 my turn ended at the second Crunkus made his scoring adjudication post, and ugluk's turn started. My disagreement with Crunkus' scoring post arose during Ugluk's turn, therefore. As I read Rule 212 I am therefore the judge. If the disagreement had arisen in my turn, I would not be eligible to be the judge, but my turn ended with the scoring post.

Have I got this right?

If so, I rule that the blue votes counted and that therefore Stalin's Stamp passed and the scoring post that ended my turn is incorrect. :D

(Not trying to be difficult, just testing the rule set to destruction ;) )

Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 304 - Stalin's Stamp (judgement request

PostPosted: 02 Mar 2014, 07:59
by Ugluk
I wish to overrule super_dipsy's judgement.

Re: Nomic 5 Proposal 304 - Stalin's Stamp (judgement request

PostPosted: 02 Mar 2014, 08:03
by Ugluk
212 wrote:The Judge's Judgment may be overruled only by a three-fourths vote of the other players taken before the next turn is begun.


Since judgement has been invoked during my turn, per Dipsy, we are still in my turn, and Dipsy's judgement may be challenged until my turn has been scored. If overruled, judgement falls upon Pagane.