Rules

Played with a different set of Wing rules. GM: Pedros; Winner: Diadem (Turkey)

Re: Rules

Postby Pedros » 15 Oct 2013, 05:14

Yes they can
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Re: Rules

Postby Pedros » 15 Oct 2013, 05:17

Diadem wrote:Just posting here to put this thread in my egosearch.

Though I suppose I do have a question. Can you clarify the rules for cutting Wings one more time? Support given by a Wing unit is not cut if the base of the wing unit is attacked, but only if an enemy wing unit wants to travel through the same space as the wing unit, correct? But 'travel through' only happens for distance 2 moves, right? So if I support a unit next to, I can't be cut. And if I travel through a province that another wing is atttacking or supporting into, that doesn't cut the support (since the other wing is not moving through the province, but into). Do I have that correct?

Not correct. Both the target area and any intermediate area have to be free of Wings of other nations or they are intercepted.
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Re: Rules

Postby Pedros » 15 Oct 2013, 10:55

Diadem wrote:Map question: Does Sin border Sau? (in the south-east corner).

While we're at it. What about Gib and Mor?

Just to confirm, No and No. (Important, because it gives Jordan a coastline)
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Re: Wings rules

Postby ThorondorNL » 16 Oct 2013, 07:05

Pedros wrote:
  1. Where a Wing orders an attack or support over a distance of two spaces, the first space must not be occupied at the start of the turn by an enemy unit or else the order is invalid;
  2. Wings which are attempting to attack or support but which meet one or more enemy Wings in flight bounce and return to base with their mission unsuccessful.
  3. After an attack or a support order, the Wing is assumed to have returned to its original location ("its base") provided that the base was not destroyed during that turn.
  4. Wings which are dislodged from their base location are immediately destroyed
  5. A wing which successfully moves to an SC (not previously controlled by that power) and remains there after a Fall season gains control of the SC just as a fleet or army would do.


I still have a few questions:

So wings can fly over armies and fleets, but not if another wing is in the area they are flying over?
and if a wing attacks an army with 2 armies supporting it and the enemy army is dislodged, the wing will still return to it's base and the attacked area or SC will be empty?
New wing bases can only be made when the area of the new base wasn't occupied one turn before the wing flew in?
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Re: Wings rules

Postby Pedros » 16 Oct 2013, 10:45

Thorondor. wrote:
Pedros wrote:
  1. Where a Wing orders an attack or support over a distance of two spaces, the first space must not be occupied at the start of the turn by an enemy unit or else the order is invalid;
  2. Wings which are attempting to attack or support but which meet one or more enemy Wings in flight bounce and return to base with their mission unsuccessful.
  3. After an attack or a support order, the Wing is assumed to have returned to its original location ("its base") provided that the base was not destroyed during that turn.
  4. Wings which are dislodged from their base location are immediately destroyed
  5. A wing which successfully moves to an SC (not previously controlled by that power) and remains there after a Fall season gains control of the SC just as a fleet or army would do.


I still have a few questions:

So wings can fly over armies and fleets, but not if another wing is in the area they are flying over?
and if a wing attacks an army with 2 armies supporting it and the enemy army is dislodged, the wing will still return to it's base and the attacked area or SC will be empty?
New wing bases can only be made when the area of the new base wasn't occupied one turn before the wing flew in?

Wings can fly over their own armies and fleets but the first space of 2 can't be occupied by a different power.

Yes, retruns to base and space empty

New wing bases are created in the same way as armies and fleets - in home SCs.
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Re: Wings rules

Postby Zadaron » 16 Oct 2013, 11:13

Pedros wrote:
Thorondor. wrote:and if a wing attacks an army with 2 armies supporting it and the enemy army is dislodged, the wing will still return to it's base and the attacked area or SC will be empty?
New wing bases can only be made when the area of the new base wasn't occupied one turn before the wing flew in?


Yes, retruns to base and space empty

New wing bases are created in the same way as armies and fleets - in home SCs.


I didn't think a Wing's attack could dislodge anything? Or be supported for that matter? Just break support and prevent an enemy from moving INTO the area.

I think what he meant about new wing bases was moving the wing. Unless i'm mistaken a wing moves exactly like an army except that it has a strength of 0. It can move into any empty territory or even dislodge an enemy with sufficient support.
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Re: Rules

Postby Pedros » 16 Oct 2013, 14:13

I've checked back to the original rules discussion Zadaron, and I have to admit that's what I wrote there as well as being the strict interpretation of the rules. So that's how it is.

However, I'll probably argue after this game for a revision there. It seems to me that if two British Wings attack an unsupported army in Brest (one attacking, one supporting) then it's 2v1 and the army should be dislodged. They wouldn't take control of the centre because they can't occupy it; but they should surely be able to drive out an enemy unit?

However, that's a discussion for another place and, I'd say, after the game when we've had a longer chance to assess their relative strength.
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Re: Rules

Postby Diadem » 16 Oct 2013, 16:55

Ok so for this game: They can't dislodge a unit, but they can prevent a unit from entering a space? Presumably they can then also prevent a dislodgement by beleaugered garrison?

One thing I find weird. You said wings disrupt eachother if they act in the same space.

Image power A uses unit a to support unit b. Power B uses a wing to attack a to cut its support. Power C also uses a wing to attack a to cut its support. Am I correct in understanding that the two wings cancel eachother, regardless of other support involved? So that the support of a to b would in fact be valid.

Also if wing A flies through province X to Y, and in each of those an enemy wing is active, does the wing in Y get cancelled? Or does A not act in Y because it is intercepted in X? Beware that this could lead to paradoxes.
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Re: Rules

Postby Diadem » 16 Oct 2013, 17:05

Also, if wings can't dislodge, does that mean they can't cause a convoy to fail?

This is getting complicated
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Re: Rules

Postby ThorondorNL » 16 Oct 2013, 17:06

Is this correct:

Wings can only stay in the base they are build in and if you move them they can only stay in SC's, wich will become the new homebase. But if they dislodge an army from a SC with support they have to return and the SC will not be conquered. Wings cant stay in SC's not conquered by you even if they move there? so if you move a wing to a neutral SC in spring it will return, and in fall it will stay in the SC?
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