AAR 132318. She was bleeding badly from a face-lift

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Re: AAR 132318. She was bleeding badly from a face-lift

Postby Sbrubbles » 27 Jul 2017, 22:47

youngweezy wrote:
Sbrubbles wrote:Germany and England had a stalemate established and no reason to stab one another. One of them should have called in a moderator to enforce the draw, this fits every condition for a deadlocked game.


You're supposed to play to get the best possible result, and a 3 way draw was not the best possible result.


If all three players were playing to get "the best possible result" you three would have been playing literally forever. There is no obligation for one of them to surrender, much less to stab the other (because a three way draw is a better result than losing to a solo). This is why there are house rules on this site that if a game is stuck in a stalemate for 3 years with no possibility of breaking out you can contact a moderator and he'll call it a draw.

Lucky you, neither of them did it.
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Re: AAR 132318. She was bleeding badly from a face-lift

Postby youngweezy » 27 Jul 2017, 23:08

Sbrubbles wrote:
youngweezy wrote:
Sbrubbles wrote:Germany and England had a stalemate established and no reason to stab one another. One of them should have called in a moderator to enforce the draw, this fits every condition for a deadlocked game.


You're supposed to play to get the best possible result, and a 3 way draw was not the best possible result.


If all three players were playing to get "the best possible result" you three would have been playing literally forever. There is no obligation for one of them to surrender, much less to stab the other (because a three way draw is a better result than losing to a solo). This is why there are house rules on this site that if a game is stuck in a stalemate for 3 years with no possibility of breaking out you can contact a moderator and he'll call it a draw.

Lucky you, neither of them did it.


It's a better result for them, not for me. I don't think it's unreasonable to reject a draw with countries who were less than half my size. Have you seen game #77716? That's a perfect example of why one should never accept a draw that isn't in everyone's best interest.
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Re: AAR 132318. She was bleeding badly from a face-lift

Postby Sbrubbles » 27 Jul 2017, 23:38

youngweezy wrote:
Sbrubbles wrote:
If all three players were playing to get "the best possible result" you three would have been playing literally forever. There is no obligation for one of them to surrender, much less to stab the other (because a three way draw is a better result than losing to a solo). This is why there are house rules on this site that if a game is stuck in a stalemate for 3 years with no possibility of breaking out you can contact a moderator and he'll call it a draw.

Lucky you, neither of them did it.


It's a better result for them, not for me. I don't think it's unreasonable to reject a draw with countries who were less than half my size. Have you seen game #77716? That's a perfect example of why one should never accept a draw that isn't in everyone's best interest.


Do you not see the problem when, by your own definition, a game will go on forever unless someone surrenders?

They either were ignorant of the possibility of calling in a mod or didn't want to make the effort (perfectly reasonable, it's just a game after all), but if I were one of them I would have done so and received my draw. Or are you arguing that, in fact, the mod would have sided with you?

Also, that game was won by stubborness, and is precisely why these deadlock house rules exist and should be used whenever applicable.
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Re: AAR 132318. She was bleeding badly from a face-lift

Postby youngweezy » 27 Jul 2017, 23:51

Sbrubbles wrote:
They either were ignorant of the possibility of calling in a mod or didn't want to make the effort (perfectly reasonable, it's just a game after all), but if I were one of them I would have done so and received my draw. Or are you arguing that, in fact, the mod would have sided with you?


I don't know if they would've sided with me, but I would hope they would see that I wasn't being unreasonable. Having gone from almost being eliminated early on to being one center away from a solo, I don't think anyone should be surprised that I rejected the draws. The first draw they proposed was a 4 way. Would you have accepted the draw if you were in my position?

There's a reason why the winner of that game is one of the top players on the site. He plays to get the best result.
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Re: AAR 132318. She was bleeding badly from a face-lift

Postby Sbrubbles » 28 Jul 2017, 00:22

youngweezy wrote:
Sbrubbles wrote:
They either were ignorant of the possibility of calling in a mod or didn't want to make the effort (perfectly reasonable, it's just a game after all), but if I were one of them I would have done so and received my draw. Or are you arguing that, in fact, the mod would have sided with you?


I don't know if they would've sided with me, but I would hope they would see that I wasn't being unreasonable. Having gone from almost being eliminated early on to being one center away from a solo, I don't think anyone should be surprised that I rejected the draws. The first draw they proposed was a 4 way. Would you have accepted the draw if you were in my position?

There's a reason why the winner of that game is one of the top players on the site. He plays to get the best result.


I completely agree with your refusal of the 4 way draw, and I commend you for not accepting it, but that's different, because France could be eliminated without any appreciable risk, and everyone gains from going from a 4 way draw to a 3 way draw. England eliminating Germany or vice versa could never happen without you taking the solo, so reducing it further to a 2 way draw was completely out of the table.

By refusing to draw, you turned the game from a game of strategy and intrigue into a pure game of patience, of logging in every day and making the exact same moves. You may have played a brilliant game up to the stalemate and I don't deny that, but I don't think you're being reasonable in forcing the game to go on until an NMR happens, and neither was the guy in that game, no matter how much of a "top player" he is.
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Re: AAR 132318. She was bleeding badly from a face-lift

Postby youngweezy » 28 Jul 2017, 00:54

Sbrubbles wrote:By refusing to draw, you turned the game from a game of strategy and intrigue into a pure game of patience, of logging in every day and making the exact same moves. You may have played a brilliant game up to the stalemate and I don't deny that, but I don't think you're being reasonable in forcing the game to go on until an NMR happens, and neither was the guy in that game, no matter how much of a "top player" he is.


Fair enough. I appreciate the feedback.
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