Page 1 of 2

Honor Among Diplomats <Variant> - Need 5 more (of 8)

PostPosted: 22 Oct 2010, 22:18
by GhostEcho
I'm looking for players to test-play a variant I'm working on as a personal project. I plan to GM. This is a work-in-progress for two reasons; first, I probably would change the map after one game to reflect problems encountered.

Second, this is a variant based on the universe of David Weber's Honor Harrington series. All place names, universe, etc. are his IP; my map is based on the (fan-made) map available on wikipedia. As such, 1) my opinion is not final and 2) as the series is ongoing, more information will be revealed which will necessitate changes

(For example: In the first books, we know almost nothing about the Solarian League. We now know that it's pretty much bigger than everybody else put together - in fact (and this is simplifying) my "Maya Sector" and "Mesan Alignment" are basically factions within the league, and the "Talbott Cluster" lives in its shadow. But we still don't know enough about the league to really fill in its geography properly. Future books may enlighten the subject, and will likely result in adding 2 or 3 (or four or five) factions either within or to to entirely replace the League.)

Although my map is currently an amalgamation of information as positions from the 20-30 years the books now span, I'm going to make an executive decision: moves will start (as usual, entertainingly enough) with Spring 1901, when the first of the books starts. (It's a different dating system in the series, yo.)

Map
Image

Board (8)
Anderman Empire (yellow; 3 home SCs; 1 fort, 2 fleets)
Republic of Haven (blue; 4 home SCs; 1 fort, 3 fleets)
Kingdom of Manticore (orange; 3 home SCs; 1 fort, 2 fleets)
Maya Sector (cyan; 3 home SCs; 1 fort, 2 fleets)
Mesan Alignment (pink; 3 home SCs; 1 fort, 2 fleets)
Silesian Confederacy (purple; 4 home SCs; 1 fort, 3 fleets)
Solarian Leage (red; 5 home SCs; 2 forts, 3 fleets)
Talbott Cluster (green; 3 home SCs; 1 fort, 2 fleets)

28 Home SCs total
16 other SCs
--
44 total SCs; 23 to win
--
38 other territories
--
82 total territories

Rules
All rules as normal Diplomacy, except for the following variations due to the setting:

Territories
Three kinds: Supply Centers (indicated by a square marker), and Planetary (circle) and Space (triangle) territories.
Units
Fort: this is a variant-specific unit. Special rules:
  • Can be constructed in any SC or Planetary Territory (but not Space Territory) you occupy
  • Defends (holds) territory with a strength of 2
  • Cannot support adjacent territory (but can be supported)
  • Cannot move.
Fleets: standard Diplomacy unit, except:
First, a player's (single) fleet may occupy a territory also holding a fort belonging to that player.
Second, there are certain routes, or "wormholes", which allow movement between territories, with all rules applied as if they were adjacent.
Third, there is the following additional move option, "Translate".
  • A fleet may be ordered to "translate", that is, to move a certain distance "off the board" through warp.
  • A. Any time may be specified, and any destination normally reachable in that time may be given. The translation fleet is not subject to any hindrances during movement, but may be bounced at the destination.
  • A.1. Any translation order given for a destination, with a time specified too short in which to make the journey, will have the time automatically extended to whatever number of seasons is necessary.
  • A.2. A translation order may not require any wormhole transit to achieve the ordered time. If any such order is given, the destination will remain but the time will automatically become the shortest necessary to travel the distance under normal movement.
  • B. A fleet attacking from translation may be supported to its destination in the season it arrives.
  • C. If the move to a territory is bounced at the time of arrival, a translating fleet must retreat to a territory adjacent its destination, or disband.
  • D. Destination and length of translation should be ordered initially and may not be changed during transit. Neither destination nor length of travel will be revealed publicly
  • E. If no time is specified but a destination is, the translation will take as long as the shortest normal move to that territory. This cannot be changed.
  • F. If a fleet is ordered to translate with no destination, it is assumed to remain "over" its territory of origin until given other orders, but is "off the board" until they take effect.
  • F.1. If a fleet with no destination is ordered to maintain translation for a certain number of seasons, it will automatically be returned to the board at its origin after that time is up. If its way is blocked by another fleet, it must retreat to an adjacent territory or disband.
  • F.2. A fleet ordered to translate with no destination may afterwards be given orders to either proceed for a certain time and destination, or to support its territory of origin (but no other territory), or to return to "on the board" at its origin (subject to possible bounce & retreat), or be given a normal move order.
  • F.2.b. A translated fleet ordered to support its territory of origin is returned to the board if that territory is attacked. At the end of the season, if another fleet occupies that territory, or if the territory contains the fort of another power, the previously-translated fleet must retreat or disband.
  • G. A translated unit, unless still "over" its territory of origin, may not be disbanded.
  • G.1. A power whose translated fleets not over origins outnumber its SC count retains those fleets until they return to the board.

Examples: (Using fleet Hil) Notice that normally Hil cannot reach Durandal because there are Andermani units in the way. The Silesian player could however order "Hil translate to Durandal, 3 seasons" (or "Hil T Durandal 3).
A. If for some reason he wanted to take longer, he could indicate a longer number of seasons in his initial order, for instance "Hil T Durandal, 4)
A.2. A move order of "Hil T Phoenix, 4" would be invalid, as 7 seasons for that movement are required unless wormholes are used. The fleet would be "off the board" for 7 seasons while making the journey.
B. The Silesian player could order Carlton -> Marsh -> Valhalla and in the third season order Carlton S Hil (T) -> Durandal.
C. Assume an unsupported Hil reaches Durandal and meets a move such as Sligo -> Durandal. This will bounce. Sligo will return to Sligo, and F Hil (T) must retreat to a territory adjacent Durandal, for instance to Asgerd.
E. If the order given is "Hil T Durandal", it will take 3 seasons.
F. The order "Hil T" will take Hil "off the board" but it is assumed to remain "at" Hil.
F.1. If the order were "Hil T 4", it would be returned to the board at Hil (assuming no retreat) after 4 seasons.
F.2. If given the order "Hil T 4", a season later the player might order "Hil (T) -> Gem", or even "Hil (T) -> Gem 2". A translated fleet is assumed to remain translated until it reaches its destination.
G.1. And yes, this means a player facing elimination can simply order all remaining fleets to scatter on his (otherwise) last turn, and hope. To mix metaphors, or at least universes, wildly, I call this the "Renegade House" rule, but it's an inevitable consequence of not being able to affect translated units' movement orders in any way.

I have attempted to make the above as clear as possible. If you have further questions, please ask. If you ask a question, please come up with an example scenario.

Players:
1. vaderi
2. mat.gopack
3. Palin
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.

Reserve:
1.
2.
3.

Re: Honor Among Diplomats <Variant> - Need 8 Players + reserves

PostPosted: 23 Oct 2010, 16:41
by vaderi
I'll join. I like the universe and the map looks fun

I'd also like to point out a possible map change, as the map stands The Silesian Confederation has the advantage over The Anderman Empire because of the positions of the SCs at Bre andd Pos. I suggest moving the SC at Pos to Sag (and making Pos a planet).

Also the rightmost part of the map is cut off, I can see the whole map in while I'm posting but not in the rest of the thread. the cutoff starts just left of Isaak ;) .

EDIT: 1 question about translation, does the territory you are translating to have to be within the number of turns you are translating, so would Hil translate 3 to Isaak be a valid order?

Re: Honor Among Diplomats <Variant> - Need 8 Players + reserves

PostPosted: 24 Oct 2010, 01:45
by mat.gopack
im in :D
loved those books ;)

Re: Honor Among Diplomats <Variant> - Need 8 Players + reserves

PostPosted: 24 Oct 2010, 03:37
by GhostEcho
vaderi wrote:I'd also like to point out a possible map change, as the map stands The Silesian Confederation has the advantage over The Anderman Empire because of the positions of the SCs at Bre andd Pos. I suggest moving the SC at Pos to Sag (and making Pos a planet).


Silesia's a problem all around. In the series, it's essentially in Civil Disorder. If we don't get an eighth, that's exactly what I'll do with it (which in some ways might be ideal). However, to leave it out as playable gives a bunch of free SCs for the Andermani, creating other balance problems. I think (on further review) the best option might be to leave Hil as an open SC and cut Silesian starting SCs to 3.

Thoughts?

(Sag as a starting Silesian SC doesn't work because it's basically in revolt, canonically.)

vaderi wrote:Also the rightmost part of the map is cut off, I can see the whole map in while I'm posting but not in the rest of the thread. the cutoff starts just left of Isaak ;) .


I have no idea how to fix this. If you need it, you can open it in a new window/tab (right-click, then ctrl-click/apple-click on view image).

vaderi wrote:EDIT: 1 question about translation, does the territory you are translating to have to be within the number of turns you are translating, so would Hil translate 3 to Isaak be a valid order?


Uh, whoops, I should clarify that. Short answer: yes, it does. Long answer: the same rule applies as attempting to translate through a wormhole route: if you ordered "Hil T Isaak, 3", this would be processed as "Hil T Isaak, 5", 5 seasons being the minimum possible time for the journey.

Re: Honor Among Diplomats <Variant> - Need 8 Players + reserves

PostPosted: 25 Oct 2010, 06:55
by vaderi
Silesia's a problem all around. In the series, it's essentially in Civil Disorder. If we don't get an eighth, that's exactly what I'll do with it (which in some ways might be ideal). However, to leave it out as playable gives a bunch of free SCs for the Andermani, creating other balance problems. I think (on further review) the best option might be to leave Hil as an open SC and cut Silesian starting SCs to 3.

Thoughts?

(Sag as a starting Silesian SC doesn't work because it's basically in revolt, canonically.)


I think I have an idea that would work: Make Sag a space territory and instead of F Hil have A Hil. That gives Anderman several options the most important one is that Pos becomes contestable and Sach is no longer guarenteed to fall to Silesia within the first 2 years.

Uh, whoops, I should clarify that. Short answer: yes, it does. Long answer: the same rule applies as attempting to translate through a wormhole route: if you ordered "Hil T Isaak, 3", this would be processed as "Hil T Isaak, 5", 5 seasons being the minimum possible time for the journey.


ah, thanks that clears it up.

As for other suggestions that I have (I seem to be a never ending supply :) ), making Joshua a Neutral SC(and not giving the Solarian League another Fleet) means that the Solarian League and Mesa are on even footing as well as giving some reason for diplomacy between the Maya sector and the Solarian League.

Re: Honor Among Diplomats <Variant> - Need 6 more (of 8)

PostPosted: 25 Oct 2010, 17:41
by mat.gopack
what about if you move into a territory with your fort, but another country moves there too?
Ex:Phoenix-Ere
Congo-Ere

there should be a erewhonese fleet in erewhon, right?

Re: Honor Among Diplomats <Variant> - Need 6 more (of 8)

PostPosted: 25 Oct 2010, 20:09
by vaderi
mat.gopack wrote:what about if you move into a territory with your fort, but another country moves there too?
Ex:Phoenix-Ere
Congo-Ere

there should be a erewhonese fleet in erewhon, right?


well, according to the rules the other player would be bounced and your fleet/army wouldn't be bounced (it would move into the fort)

Re: Honor Among Diplomats <Variant> - Need 6 more (of 8)

PostPosted: 19 Nov 2010, 21:10
by vaderi
GhostEcho are you still planning on running this if people wanted to play?

Re: Honor Among Diplomats <Variant> - Need 6 more (of 8)

PostPosted: 20 Nov 2010, 16:44
by GhostEcho
Yes - although I've been too swamped with other things to push it heavily! So by all means, if you know somebody who would be interested...

Re: Honor Among Diplomats <Variant> - Need 6 more (of 8)

PostPosted: 20 Nov 2010, 17:57
by vaderi
well, I was bumping it up and making sure it would still have a GM ;) . I'll be checking with some friends soon but I don't expect they will come back to Playdip :(