LOTR Middle Earth variant FULL (looking for reserves)

8-player scenario based on The Lord of the Rings, desgined by Lew Pulsipher and introduced by Presser84. GM Presser84. Winner: thewysecat (Gondor)

Re: LOTR Middle Earth variant Looking for one more spot

Postby Mouse » 23 Mar 2012, 15:09

You know that an argument has been lost when the "race card" is thrown out there. But let it be said that I would not discriminate against hobbits (though they are simply large footed critters those purpose it would appear to be the over indulgence of food & drink - not much use actually as a race). I also never stereotype! I am beyond such things.
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Re: LOTR Middle Earth variant

Postby sinnybee » 23 Mar 2012, 17:18

presser84 wrote:Is the suggestion for the Shire because you find it unrealistic for an army of Hobbits to go to war or because you see something specifically about it's location? Remember the Shire was protected by the Dúnedain Rangers, though they were all over the map, being Rangers and all.

Protected or not, it realistically shouldn't be a home supply center. In my opinion, home supply centers should be areas owned by a country or group with a significant military.
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Re: LOTR Middle Earth variant

Postby asudevil » 23 Mar 2012, 17:30

sinnybee wrote:
presser84 wrote:Is the suggestion for the Shire because you find it unrealistic for an army of Hobbits to go to war or because you see something specifically about it's location? Remember the Shire was protected by the Dúnedain Rangers, though they were all over the map, being Rangers and all.

Protected or not, it realistically shouldn't be a home supply center. In my opinion, home supply centers should be areas owned by a country or group with a significant military.


But under that thought, the dunedain, wouldnt have any home SC
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Re: LOTR Middle Earth variant

Postby sinnybee » 23 Mar 2012, 18:09

asudevil wrote:But under that thought, the dunedain, wouldnt have any home SC

None of the outside countries cared or even knew about The Shire, so my real opinion is that it shouldn't even be a SC at all.
Of course my opinion doesn't matter at the moment because I'm not making a map nor participating in one of these variants, but I probably would not make the dunedain a player or I would give them different rules.
If I were making a game, I may have Frodo move with the ring and give a bonus to (Mordor and) the country who (finds and) captures the ring, give a defense bonus to an army in Helm's Deep, and I'd be much more likely to increase places like Minas Tirith to a value of 2 SCs (and/or some other bonus) before I counted The Shire as a SC.
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Re: LOTR Middle Earth variant

Postby sinnybee » 23 Mar 2012, 18:31

Mouse wrote:
sinnybee wrote:I won't be playing, but thought I'd give my two cents:
Nice job with the map and colors on Middle Earth VIII, presser.

Five Armies:
Mordor has a powerful position, which is (a bit unbalenced but) realistic.
The northwestern player (light-blue) is the second-best starting position in my opinion (should it be?)

Middle Earth VIII:
Mordor is relatively weak.
I would think The Shire should be a neutral SC?

Anyway, just my first impressions. Godd luck and have fun.


30-years ago I made a variant. It was based off England. It encompassed the powers within the country and those that wanted to enter said country. The time period was roughly 1066 and was grossly inaccurate. I think it was a 8-player game. It had flaws. I ran the game on a board at high school. So long ago and my memory is fading. It was not balanced.

What I want to express is that we all know that Diplomacy is not a balanced game. If it was a balanced game then I would have more chance of winning. I am a piss poor diplomat. The beauty of the game is the asymmetrical aspects. It is not a fair game. You get unlucky on the draw. But like life, you deal with what you are dealt. Even those countries doomed to failure can turn the tide. That is what makes the game have depth. The powerful countries at game start are recognized as such and they better do a lot of sweet talking unless the lands rise against them. You talk as if the game is a two player one without diplomacy; diplomacy makes all the difference.

:?:
Maybe I should have made it clear: I favor a strong, realistic, unbalenced Mordor.
Countries should have to cooperate to prevent a Mordor solo, try to gain an alliance and secure a draw with Mordor, or lose for fighting amongst themselves.

"The powerful countries at game start are recognized as such"
No, I disagree. There are far too few players who sufficiently recognize the power that some positions hold and/or sufficiently deal with that power.
Turkey, Russia, and France will continue to have the most victory success, except in tournament games in which prior standings are taken into account and games that are played amongst veteran and/or high ranked players.
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Re: LOTR Middle Earth variant Looking for one more spot

Postby Pedros » 23 Mar 2012, 19:35

Can I just throw in my two pen'worth as somebody who isn't going to play this game.

Reality is all very well, but the important thing is a balanced and playable game. And anyway, aren't you playing an existing variant? If so you want a good reason to change it!
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Re: LOTR Middle Earth variant Looking for one more spot

Postby sinnybee » 23 Mar 2012, 19:48

Pedros wrote:Can I just throw in my two pen'worth as somebody who isn't going to play this game.

Reality is all very well, but the important thing is a balanced and playable game. And anyway, aren't you playing an existing variant? If so you want a good reason to change it!

I don't think presser is considering changing the variant(s) and I was just chatting up some what ifs. ;)
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Re: LOTR Middle Earth variant Looking for one more spot

Postby VGhost » 23 Mar 2012, 20:09

Only one game on at the moment; if there's still a spot I'd be interested in filling it.

(Nerd comment: interesting that the map appears to be set up in ME8 as a recreation not of LOTR but of some period between the two Third Age wars against Sauron... despite the creator's comments.)
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Re: LOTR Middle Earth variant Looking for one more spot

Postby presser84 » 23 Mar 2012, 21:42

GhostEcho wrote:Only one game on at the moment; if there's still a spot I'd be interested in filling it.

(Nerd comment: interesting that the map appears to be set up in ME8 as a recreation not of LOTR but of some period between the two Third Age wars against Sauron... despite the creator's comments.)


I received a PM from mr bump earlier this morning expressing interest but he wants to see the full rules first. If be backs and doesn't like the rules I'll bump you into the game. I put you down as a reserve in case he does not confirm.

You are right though. There are several inconsistencies to the the exact Tolkien Lore. My goal was to play a game that was based on the Tolkien map that would be as close to balanced as possible. We could develop a map and variant that closely mirrors the events of Silmarillion or LOTR trilogy but that isn't my goal here.
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Re: LOTR Middle Earth variant FULL (looking for reserves)

Postby drrnwrstlr » 23 Mar 2012, 22:34

presser84 wrote:You are right though. There are several inconsistencies to the the exact Tolkien Lore. My goal was to play a game that was based on the Tolkien map that would be as close to balanced as possible. We could develop a map and variant that closely mirrors the events of Silmarillion or LOTR trilogy but that isn't my goal here.

Maybe 986690324 could do that, since he was wanting to GM a LOTR variant of some kind.
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