Look at the Animals Mafia: Game Over, Scum Win

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Re: Look at the Animals Mafia: Day 3

Postby Telleo » 27 Sep 2018, 20:27

Keirador wrote:I'm sorry y'all, for some reason I was sure the day ended in the morning (Eastern time), and sat down to play just to find the Day was over. No idea why I thought that.

Anyway, I think and hope that I had made my preferences pretty clear: SJG for another Day, or failing that, dwilt, so even without a vote down I shouldn't be a mystery.


I mean I get that you made your preferences clear. I don't disagree. I just am wondering how those preferences never became a vote at any point in the past two days.
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Re: Look at the Animals Mafia: Day 3

Postby Telleo » 27 Sep 2018, 20:31

Keirador wrote:I'd also point out that you can at least believe I really wasn't around for EOD regardless of alignment, because if I'm scum (which would mean dwilt is town), and I had been around, I could've voted to put dwilt in contention and possibly win.


Sure, agreed you weren't here.

Telleo wrote:If Dwilt were scum, he could have voted me yesterday. I thought he was gone when I switched my vote away from him, but he reappeared after. To test, I hung around the deadline to switch my vote if Dwilt re-voted, and did so while hiding my online status, something I typically don't do. I saw Dwilt here. I know he was observing until at least 6:00 my time (the given EOD deadline). If he'd voted me and gotten away with it, scumDwilt woulda won yesterday. Makes me pretty hesitant to vote him tonight.

Same logic should apply here, but I don't think it does. My whole deal on dwilt, the reason I townread him so frequently, is that he's very committed as town. The inverse is that he isn't as scum. I've seen him just straight up quit as scum, under like no pressure. Yes, as scum who was paying attention and pursuing a win condition, he could have made a play for the win at EOD. That he didn't do so doesn't make me think he's therefore town. It's fully and completely within the meta on him that I've been working with, that has been so accurate so far, that he's just scum and doesn't give a shit when he's scum.


Yeah, ok. Fair enough.

So, dwilt.


Yaaaaaaaaay!

This is further supported by some insta-townreads I had on UFO on D2. I'll go back and detail that. At the mo', I literally cannot remember the cause, just the read.


Were they in-thread yesterday? I don't really remember if you said then.
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Re: Look at the Animals Mafia: Day 1

Postby Telleo » 27 Sep 2018, 20:32

Keirador wrote:
UFO Fever wrote:Hey Telleo would you mind telling us what the fuck just happened?

Oh right, it was right there in the beginning of the day. This is. . . well to be frank, this is dumb. The underpinning of this vote doesn't stand up to the the slightest scrutiny. It was pretty clear from a reading of the roles/rules that Telleo wasn't the reason for that elimination, nor even was dwilt based on published available information. An actual scum would've know this was a stupid vote before making it. I see this as something of a derpclear, and I don't think UFO is somebody who attempts derpclears.


But like... weren't you questioning him around that issue yesterday? So when did this become an "insta-townread?"
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Re: Look at the Animals Mafia: Day 3

Postby Telleo » 27 Sep 2018, 20:39

bkbkbk wrote:Right. Only way I can justify scum-Telleo now is if the mafia nightkill was one-time-only, there's too many loops to jump through for it to make sense otherwise. But it was confirmed that they had a usual factional nightkill, right?

The question then is why Telleo is still alive. Telleo, why doesn't scum-Keirador kill you last night? In that scenario he's going to push on dwilt for the last lynch and you're the only one who's expressed doubts about that. Doesn't he just kill you and gently massage my confirmation bias to get the win? Seems to me that the only person who keeps you alive last night as scum is dwilt.


I mean, scumKeir is on record as being anti-doing-the-town's-work-for-them. I fully believe scum Keir does not conduct a kill that night, especially knowing that the town MUST conduct a lynch the following day. Not because I'm not a good kill target, just because unless I'm 100% locked-town-clear, it's eliminating uncertainty from the town.

Telleo wrote:If Dwilt were scum, he could have voted me yesterday. I thought he was gone when I switched my vote away from him, but he reappeared after. To test, I hung around the deadline to switch my vote if Dwilt re-voted, and did so while hiding my online status, something I typically don't do. I saw Dwilt here. I know he was observing until at least 6:00 my time (the given EOD deadline). If he'd voted me and gotten away with it, scumDwilt woulda won yesterday. Makes me pretty hesitant to vote him tonight.

Bolded is the key thing for me. I never feel great about this sort of reasoning because it assumes scum are bold enough to go for the big play like that, and I don't think many people are. Especially when we don't play with hard deadlines on this site - look how much time you all had past the original deadline at the end of day 1.


Valid. It's the kind of thing I mighta done in Dwilt's shoes, but I suppose you're right that it's not fair for me to apply that to Dwilt's game. And I'm by no means taking it as hard clear. Just... seemed like a missed opportunity for scumDwilt.

But like, Telleo, you've got this line of reasoning and you've got your reaction test stuff from yesterday - why did you poison dwilt last night? Surely the play would have been to poison Keriador and then lynch dwilt in case you're wrong?


Ah. Because see, if Dwilt WAS scum, his power MIGHT have been an insta-kill. In which case using it on someone else would mean we'd lose. Letting him use it himself would mean we'd insta lose (assuming possible multiple NKs). Targeting him with it means we insta win. On the other hand, if his power was the town version, it wouldn't hurt anyone, because the game ends by the time he dies, one way or the other. If I'd known for sure that Dwilt's power was the town power, I'd defs have poisoned either you or Keir and lynched Dwilt/the other one for multiple shots... but knowing that Dwilt's power was the town power would require me to also know he's town.
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Re: Look at the Animals Mafia: Day 3

Postby Telleo » 27 Sep 2018, 20:40

Dwiltse1114 wrote:
Telleo wrote:Keir. How have we ended two days, both in overtime, without you placing a single vote?

FY'allsI, Dwilt's probs gonna die at EOD. I stole his power and hit him with it. If he's town, he'll die at EOD. If he's not town, well, I hoped his scum power was just a straight kill, but it evidently is not.


I would die at EOD seeing as how the snake isn't immune to his own ability (no indication that snake is immune to his own ability in the role itself)... so im an auto death at EOD and lynching me is a sure fire way to 1 lose the game as town and 2 a waste of a lynch seeing as how ill be dead when whoever gets lynched is lynched anyway...


Only if your ability is the town ability we know about. If it's the scum ability and DOESN'T result in your death, then lynching anyone else means we lose.
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Re: Look at the Animals Mafia: Day 3

Postby Telleo » 27 Sep 2018, 20:42

Dwiltse1114 wrote:
Telleo wrote:Also.

If I were scum, I'd have won last night (unless one of y'all wants to argue that I knew about the NK, knew that a no-lynch would put us at MYLO, and knew that I'd be stealing a power that kills people at EOD, and therefore knew that I only had to survive one more day because if literally anyone else was lynched I'd win, and chose NOT to do that as scum).

If Dwilt were scum, he could have voted me yesterday. I thought he was gone when I switched my vote away from him, but he reappeared after. To test, I hung around the deadline to switch my vote if Dwilt re-voted, and did so while hiding my online status, something I typically don't do. I saw Dwilt here. I know he was observing until at least 6:00 my time (the given EOD deadline). If he'd voted me and gotten away with it, scumDwilt woulda won yesterday. Makes me pretty hesitant to vote him tonight.

So right now I'm picking between the slot that ZZ soul-townread, but then had a batshit crazy opening yesterday, but evidently also had RL stuff, and who was then replaced by bkbkbk who's played calmly so far, and the slot that has had a lot of reads to offer but never placed a vote.


bolded underlined---again what (for once) gives telleo a town clear from me and yall can argue that I would keep telleo alive as scum which would be true but I also wouldn't choose to not kill anyone as scum I most likely would have went for bk (ufo) as he is also kinda an overall town read...


So wait. Walk me through why you kill BK and not me last night?
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Re: Look at the Animals Mafia: Day 3

Postby Telleo » 27 Sep 2018, 20:47

Cool. So just for funsies.

bk3.

Dwilt, bk3 and Keir are gonna vote to kill you. If you expect to win, you need to convince me to move back to Keir. Hop to bk3 and I'll join them in killing you. Fail to convince me and I'll join them in killing you. But the entire case on you is "Dwilt isn't committed the way he would be if he were town" and all you're saying is "Yeah, I'm totally not committed." That's not good enough if you're town.
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Re: Look at the Animals Mafia: Day 3

Postby Dwiltse1114 » 27 Sep 2018, 20:55

Telleo wrote:
Dwiltse1114 wrote:
Telleo wrote:Keir. How have we ended two days, both in overtime, without you placing a single vote?

FY'allsI, Dwilt's probs gonna die at EOD. I stole his power and hit him with it. If he's town, he'll die at EOD. If he's not town, well, I hoped his scum power was just a straight kill, but it evidently is not.


I would die at EOD seeing as how the snake isn't immune to his own ability (no indication that snake is immune to his own ability in the role itself)... so im an auto death at EOD and lynching me is a sure fire way to 1 lose the game as town and 2 a waste of a lynch seeing as how ill be dead when whoever gets lynched is lynched anyway...


Only if your ability is the town ability we know about. If it's the scum ability and DOESN'T result in your death, then lynching anyone else means we lose.


true but at the same time I would highly highly doubt that a snake scum ability would include the purse that "using the scum snakes ability on himself will not kill the snake" or something of the like... honestly when the game comes to a close im genuinely curious what the other ability would have been for scum snake...
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Re: Look at the Animals Mafia: Day 3

Postby Dwiltse1114 » 27 Sep 2018, 20:58

Telleo wrote:
Dwiltse1114 wrote:
Telleo wrote:Also.

If I were scum, I'd have won last night (unless one of y'all wants to argue that I knew about the NK, knew that a no-lynch would put us at MYLO, and knew that I'd be stealing a power that kills people at EOD, and therefore knew that I only had to survive one more day because if literally anyone else was lynched I'd win, and chose NOT to do that as scum).

If Dwilt were scum, he could have voted me yesterday. I thought he was gone when I switched my vote away from him, but he reappeared after. To test, I hung around the deadline to switch my vote if Dwilt re-voted, and did so while hiding my online status, something I typically don't do. I saw Dwilt here. I know he was observing until at least 6:00 my time (the given EOD deadline). If he'd voted me and gotten away with it, scumDwilt woulda won yesterday. Makes me pretty hesitant to vote him tonight.

So right now I'm picking between the slot that ZZ soul-townread, but then had a batshit crazy opening yesterday, but evidently also had RL stuff, and who was then replaced by bkbkbk who's played calmly so far, and the slot that has had a lot of reads to offer but never placed a vote.


bolded underlined---again what (for once) gives telleo a town clear from me and yall can argue that I would keep telleo alive as scum which would be true but I also wouldn't choose to not kill anyone as scum I most likely would have went for bk (ufo) as he is also kinda an overall town read...


So wait. Walk me through why you kill BK and not me last night?


if I was scum I would kill either kier or bk most likely kier in all honesty because bk might seem to obvious as a death for a scum dwiltse to kill as bk pushed the hardest... id choose one of those 2 over u simply because you were the only one not solid scum reading me still giving me that chance to persuade to get either u or kier/bk to lynch the other...
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Re: Look at the Animals Mafia: Day 3

Postby Dwiltse1114 » 27 Sep 2018, 21:02

Telleo wrote:Cool. So just for funsies.

bk3.

Dwilt, bk3 and Keir are gonna vote to kill you. If you expect to win, you need to convince me to move back to Keir. Hop to bk3 and I'll join them in killing you. Fail to convince me and I'll join them in killing you. But the entire case on you is "Dwilt isn't committed the way he would be if he were town" and all you're saying is "Yeah, I'm totally not committed." That's not good enough if you're town.


well whichever ive defended myself to the best of my abilities in this game gave reasoning as to why I think scum is kier over you or bk (ufo) and that's all I can really do im not putting a surplus of hours to try to convince one to vote kier over myself so if im lynched well guess what town loses in a game that im not gonna sweat about as I haven't from the very beginning...

ive been on here now for about 6 hours keeping track while doing other things of import so if theres any questions ill answer them as for that ive done what I am able...
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