Mafia CLXIV: Second Chance Mafia Day 4

[Nanook]

Regarding ZZ and SJG's interaction. I think that I like ZZ more out of it--feels a little disingenuous on the part of SJG, trying to manufacture a "scumslip." I don't feel strongly about it, but that would be my impression.

What makes you think I was trying to manufacture a scumslip there? Do you see how I read ZZ's post in a way that made me think he had slipped?

I don't really see how it would be read as a scum slip, which is why I see you as possibly trying to manufacture it. I doubt it's to try and get him killed, because there's no way he's killed for that--I would say that it's more likely you're trying to manufacture it as a way of looking active.

Maybe I'm missing something and it looks worse than I'm giving it credit for?

[Nanook]

The it that looks worse in my second paragraph would be ZZ's post, for clarifies sake.

[shadowface]

Does everyone who has played with him a lot before agree that this is one of his most significant scum tells?

Concerning night actions, yeah, he's said he does that as scum in previous games. As for being afraid to post, I haven't really noticed that. It almost seems the opposite. But that's how it appears, not how he feels. He could just be doing a good job disguising his fears (kind of the whole point of playing scum).

[Zoomzip]

I'm not sure that SJG might not have been trying to manufacture a reasons to be active.

What say you, sjg? Did this play into your reaction at all?

That being said, I'm not even sure that manufacturing a reason to be active is even that bad.

[Keirador]

Sigh. Town again. I guess with this set-up I should be utterly indifferent to being lynched, though, so that's something.

This should be interesting since I am trying the Keirador method for this game of being low activity but hopefully high impact and not throwing votes around per our discussion in the Men at Arms AAR. We shall see how it goes.

I feel something's been lost if you reckon I advocate "low activity."

[Keirador]

If someone is NKed or misvoted, and flips town, they are not a vote candidate until we get at least one scum player killed. Dig me?

Yeah this looks sound.

[sjg11]

Regarding ZZ and SJG's interaction. I think that I like ZZ more out of it--feels a little disingenuous on the part of SJG, trying to manufacture a "scumslip." I don't feel strongly about it, but that would be my impression.

What makes you think I was trying to manufacture a scumslip there? Do you see how I read ZZ's post in a way that made me think he had slipped?

What's more interesting is why SJG would just assume that as scum I would suck that badly and wouldn't actually try and consider what my town meaning might have been.

I get why this is your process from your perspective. But, I feel like I need to explain my process here.

I saw your process saying to lynch in the pool of 2-life players, took that comment as a scumslip and voted immediately. Like it was an excited "Oh my God, I've just caught a scumslip" type vote. Not a "Mwahahahahahahahahaha, I'm an evil genius and have spent 14 years planning for this moment having thought through every single detail in complete detail" type vote. You get me? I was in "vote first, ask questions later" mode.

And then, like two minutes later, I re-evaluated given your comments, had an "Oh, that's what he means" moment and unvoted. I feel like this process is pretty well represented from my posts at the time.

I don't think SJG was trying to manufacture a reason to kill me.

Good because I wasn't.

I'm not sure that SJG might not have been trying to manufacture a reasons to be active.

My initial question and post was me manufacturing activity to get people into the thread and start conversation. The vote wasn't, I sincerely thought I had caught a scumslip. No, this isn't a "sjg was laying fake votes down to create reactions so he can read into the chaos" situation. This is a "sjg misread something and got excited and voted too soon" type situation.

[sjg11]

That there are mysteriously no nightkills because I am paranoid about getting caught.
Also, I have trouble placing votes as scum. It freaks me out and I often push it off to long.

But doesn't town SF wait a while before placing votes too? Or are you saying that we can hold you to a standard if you're dallying with your vote?

I think when I'm town, it's easy if I'm pressed to vote to come up with the guy I think most likely to be scum. Whether I choose to vote or not would depend on my confidence, and as a rule I don't like to vote until my vote is going to mean something. But if I'm scum it's hard to come up with that on the spot, because I don't genuinely have a scummiest read. The case needs to be convincingly manufactured first. Ultimately the difference is that I don't feel nearly as pressured to have a vote out when I'm town. I don't know if this shows up in my play, but it's certainly a distinction in how I think.

Ok, interesting to bear in mind moving forwards...

[sjg11]

I'm not sure that SJG might not have been trying to manufacture a reasons to be active.

What say you, sjg? Did this play into your reaction at all?

As I said above, no it didn't.

[sjg11]

Hmm, ZZs main scumtell is something irrelevant to this game.

Does everyone who has played with him a lot before agree that this is one of his most significant scum tells?

Ummm... it is a scumtell that's been used to read him in the past. I have another way which I used to catch ZZ in... it was one of the recent ones, it was the one where I was abroad for most of it. Anyway, I led a last minute lynch on ZZ and I'm interested to see if the tell I've noted there is somewhat correct. I'll expand on that if it becomes relevant to the game, I suspect ZZ may be aware of it already but I want to use it at least once more before I reveal it in an AAR and it becomes defunct.