Player "Throwing the game"

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Re: Player "Throwing the game"

Postby andrewlawton » 18 Sep 2020, 23:24

I'm seen cases where people have said "I want out of this game" for whatever reason, and they've offered to me (it's happened with both allies and enemies) their SCs. While obviously I've accepted such overtures because they're free SCs, my belief is that ideally someone in that situation someone would surrender so another player can take it on. Otherwise it gives me a significant advantage in the game.

Now, consider this with the scenario in the OP of "throwing the game" as a tactic rather than a way out. It's functionally the same as the situation I just explained, though tactically different.

Both are within the rules, and both involve a human decision which inherently puts it into the spirit of the game. Remember that Diplomacy doesn't require fair or rational thought.
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Re: Player "Throwing the game"

Postby FloridaMan » 19 Sep 2020, 07:05

andrewlawton wrote:I'm seen cases where people have said "I want out of this game" for whatever reason, and they've offered to me (it's happened with both allies and enemies) their SCs. While obviously I've accepted such overtures because they're free SCs, my belief is that ideally someone in that situation someone would surrender so another player can take it on. Otherwise it gives me a significant advantage in the game.

I think, ideally, no one would ever surrender games. Typically, surrendered positions are not picked up, or they aren't picked up until years after the initial player surrendered, damaging the position. Preferably, the player who wants out would look for a substitute on the forums, and they'd then name a substitute. I myself am happy to substitute for players who are uninterested in completing their games on occasion. Of course, the real ideal is that people will finish games that they start unless they have a real emergency.
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Re: Player "Throwing the game"

Postby ToWar1901 » 05 Oct 2020, 22:22

I appreciate the debate, was just involved in a 2nd game in a row where I lost due to a Kingmaker. Just frustrating I guess.

Country A was at 13
Country B was at 8
Country C (me) was at 14

I was at a stalemate with A, had been allied with B for most of the game, saw an opportunity to potentially solo. But player B threw 5 centers to A in 1 year. After I attempted to make the stab

To expand upon the topic.... how do you beat the "Kingmaker" strategy other than either A. not stabbing anyone ever, B. making sure a stab literally kills them in 1 move, or C. just accepting its part of the game
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Re: Player "Throwing the game"

Postby jay65536 » 05 Oct 2020, 22:42

You sort of answered your own question: you have to consider “this player could throw centers to an opponent” as a potential negative consequence of stabbing.

That does mean you should stab less than you probably are. But sometimes you catch someone in a position where they can’t throw enough centers to give someone else a solo.
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Re: Player "Throwing the game"

Postby FloridaMan » 07 Oct 2020, 04:51

jay65536 wrote:You sort of answered your own question: you have to consider “this player could throw centers to an opponent” as a potential negative consequence of stabbing.

That does mean you should stab less than you probably are. But sometimes you catch someone in a position where they can’t throw enough centers to give someone else a solo.

Yeah, this.

I think that people in general do tend to stab more than they should. Sometimes even high level players stab more than they should. The temptation is powerful. We must be careful, disciplined, and precise... to make sure the knife goes in just right, and at just the right time... :mrgreen:
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Re: Player "Throwing the game"

Postby ToWar1901 » 07 Oct 2020, 14:40

Just frustrating I guess, because every game involves some level of deception. Just seems that if you don't do it early enough it costs more than its worth
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Re: Player "Throwing the game"

Postby Strategus » 07 Oct 2020, 15:38

ToWar1901 wrote:Just frustrating I guess, because every game involves some level of deception. Just seems that if you don't do it early enough it costs more than its worth
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