Disloged unit invading a country

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Disloged unit invading a country

Postby Eisenreich » 04 Mar 2017, 14:33

Dear all,

I have an easy but tricky question: if a unit is disloged, can the army retreat (in the retreat phase) to an adjacent vacant supply center, accidentally conquering it? (and in the case it was a Fall turn, potentially earning a new supply center)?

Thanks so much,
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Re: Disloged unit invading a country

Postby asudevil » 04 Mar 2017, 14:39

As long as its a valid retreat space...absolutely
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Re: Disloged unit invading a country

Postby Guns of Brixton » 04 Mar 2017, 16:03

The only places to which you cannot retreat are:
    A territory currently occupied
    The territory from which the attacker came
    A territory in which a stand-off occurred
    A territory to which your unit cannot travel
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Re: Disloged unit invading a country

Postby Jack007 » 04 Mar 2017, 23:25

And it hasn't to be accidentally. Sweet if it is part of the plan. :mrgreen:
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Re: Disloged unit invading a country

Postby ColonelApricot » 04 Mar 2017, 23:46

A favourite conundrum of mine is in FoW when the retreating player does not know whether the retreat target is embattled. The epitome of fear vs greed.
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Re: Disloged unit invading a country

Postby Phintz » 05 Mar 2017, 04:20

Can someone give me a breakdown of what happens when it's 2 v 1, and the 1 attacks the supporting unit, but the support doesn't break.

For example:
Eng F London move to North Sea
Eng F Norway support Eng F London move to North Sea
Rus F North Sea move to Norway

I can understand that in a 2v1, the 2 should win, but what are the mechanics that are taking place, how does it happen, specifically?

Because, when it gets more complex, i'm not sure how to explain it to people.

For example:
Fra F Tyrr Sea move to Ion Sea
Fra F Tunis support Fra F Tyrr Sea move to Ion Sea
Ita F Rome move to Tyrr See
Ita F Ion Sea support Ita F Rome move to Tyrr Sea
Ita F Naples support Ita F Ion Sea to hold

Fra F Tyrr Sea gets dislodged, even though Ion Sea support was broken (or would have been in most other circumstances).

I just want a better way of explaining what is going on when this happens, instead of saying, "whenever there is a 2v1, the 2 beats the 1 and support rules don't work the same".

Please advise.
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Re: Disloged unit invading a country

Postby Judison » 05 Mar 2017, 04:30

absolutely
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Re: Disloged unit invading a country

Postby Carebear » 05 Mar 2017, 04:32

Phintz wrote:Can someone give me a breakdown of what happens when it's 2 v 1, and the 1 attacks the supporting unit, but the support doesn't break.

For example:
Eng F London move to North Sea
Eng F Norway support Eng F London move to North Sea
Rus F North Sea move to Norway

I can understand that in a 2v1, the 2 should win, but what are the mechanics that are taking place, how does it happen, specifically?

Rules: https://www.wizards.com/avalonhill/rules/diplomacy.pdf

Top of page ten, bullet point.

Since Eng F Norway is giving support into North Sea, a unit in the North Sea may not cut Norway's support.


Phintz wrote:Because, when it gets more complex, i'm not sure how to explain it to people.

The bullet point makes it pretty clear. Use it.


Phintz wrote:For example:
Fra F Tyrr Sea move to Ion Sea
Fra F Tunis support Fra F Tyrr Sea move to Ion Sea
Ita F Rome move to Tyrr See
Ita F Ion Sea support Ita F Rome move to Tyrr Sea
Ita F Naples support Ita F Ion Sea to hold

Fra F Tyrr Sea gets dislodged, even though Ion Sea support was broken (or would have been in most other circumstances).

I just want a better way of explaining what is going on when this happens, instead of saying, "whenever there is a 2v1, the 2 beats the 1 and support rules don't work the same".

Please advise.

NO. Per rule just stated, F TYS cannot cut ION support. If F Nap had not supported ION to hold, then ION would have been dislodged. Then, its support would have been broken and irrelevant anyhow.
Last edited by Carebear on 05 Mar 2017, 04:39, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Disloged unit invading a country

Postby WHSeward » 05 Mar 2017, 04:33

Phintz wrote:Can someone give me a breakdown of what happens when it's 2 v 1, and the 1 attacks the supporting unit, but the support doesn't break.

For example:
Eng F London move to North Sea
Eng F Norway support Eng F London move to North Sea
Rus F North Sea move to Norway

I can understand that in a 2v1, the 2 should win, but what are the mechanics that are taking place, how does it happen, specifically?


The rule that makes the 2 beats 1 hold can be roughly stated
"Support is “cut” if the supporting unit is attacked from any province except the one where support is being given."
The idea is a unit can't cut support if the support is against itself. Otherwise you would violate the simple idea that 2 beat 1.

Phintz wrote:Because, when it gets more complex, i'm not sure how to explain it to people.

For example:
Fra F Tyrr Sea move to Ion Sea
Fra F Tunis support Fra F Tyrr Sea move to Ion Sea
Ita F Rome move to Tyrr See
Ita F Ion Sea support Ita F Rome move to Tyrr Sea
Ita F Naples support Ita F Ion Sea to hold

Fra F Tyrr Sea gets dislodged, even though Ion Sea support was broken (or would have been in most other circumstances).

I just want a better way of explaining what is going on when this happens, instead of saying, "whenever there is a 2v1, the 2 beats the 1 and support rules don't work the same".

Please advise.

Your more complicated case follows the same rules.
You have a 2 v 2 in Ion (Ion & Nap v TyS & Tun). A 2v2 is a bounce
You have a 2 v 1 in TyS (Ion & Rom v TyS). 2v1 means Rom advances. That TyS can't cut a unit supporting an attack against itself makes that hold true.
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Re: Disloged unit invading a country

Postby Phintz » 05 Mar 2017, 06:05

Awesome! Thanks guys. Great help!
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