Time for a Rules Change

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Re: Time for a Rules Change

Postby super_dipsy » 29 Mar 2018, 18:37

I think I'm banging my head against a brick wall, and the recipe for that is to stop ;)

But let me try one more time. Here is what condude wrote:

condude1 wrote:Say someone asks me to screenshot a message. My options have been limited extremely far to telling the truth or making up some BS reason I can't screenshot things. That's a massive metagamey hurdle thrown up because I can't Photoshop.


If we allow screenshots, then every time you tell anyone anything (eg I got the following message, or I can see there is a French unit in Tuscany, honest, or whatever, a likely immediate response would be 'prove it, send me a screen shot'. Certainly what I would say. I know the screenshot could be a lie, but how does the person react to the question? If you do not know how to manipulate images, you are stuffed. You COULD try to claim you don't know how to take a screen shot, but it doesn;t take much to explain to someone how to do that on their browser. So in the end the only thing you can do is fall back on 'it's against my policy to send screenshots, sorry'. Not very convincing, is it.
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Re: Time for a Rules Change

Postby NoPunIn10Did » 29 Mar 2018, 18:42

super_dipsy wrote:
If we allow screenshots, then every time you tell anyone anything (eg I got the following message, or I can see there is a French unit in Tuscany, honest, or whatever, a likely immediate response would be 'prove it, send me a screen shot'. Certainly what I would say. I know the screenshot could be a lie, but how does the person react to the question? If you do not know how to manipulate images, you are stuffed. You COULD try to claim you don't know how to take a screen shot, but it doesn;t take much to explain to someone how to do that on their browser. So in the end the only thing you can do is fall back on 'it's against my policy to send screenshots, sorry'. Not very convincing, is it.


Then maybe the rule shouldn't be "you can't share screenshots" but rather "you can't ask for them."
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Re: Time for a Rules Change

Postby Machiara » 29 Mar 2018, 18:45

Completely on board with Dipsy here. No screenshots. I have enough on my plate without having to become an expert image editor as well. Why would we want to make playing this game take even MORE time?
Personally I'm always ready to learn, although I do not always like being taught.

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Re: Time for a Rules Change

Postby NoPunIn10Did » 29 Mar 2018, 18:51

Machiara wrote:I have enough on my plate without having to become an expert image editor as well.


You

Don't

Need

To.

Lying with pictures does not require you to edit images. You are more capable of doing this than you think.
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Re: Time for a Rules Change

Postby SteveHybrid » 29 Mar 2018, 19:16

super_dipsy wrote:If we allow screenshots, then every time you tell anyone anything (eg I got the following message, or I can see there is a French unit in Tuscany, honest, or whatever, a likely immediate response would be 'prove it, send me a screen shot'. Certainly what I would say. I know the screenshot could be a lie, but how does the person react to the question? If you do not know how to manipulate images, you are stuffed.

The same could be said to someone who doesn't alter messages well, bluff good or any other skill. Altering images isn't the all mighty way to deceive people, it's just another tool in the bag of tricks to get ahead. Like anything else, some will be good at it, some won't.

The art of deception isn't solely about written skill. It's social engineering which is based on the psychological manipulation of people into performing actions or divulging confidential information. Why limit the tools players have?
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Re: Time for a Rules Change

Postby super_dipsy » 29 Mar 2018, 20:09

Hybrid wrote:The same could be said to someone who doesn't alter messages well, bluff good or any other skill.

These are all in my mind skills related to the game. if someone is a better bluffer than you, or a better strategist, or a better wordsmith, then that is a skill they have at Diplomacy. In my opinion, being able to edit images is not. Being able to hack another player is not. Putting a recording device in your friend's room is not.

NoPunIn10Did wrote:Then maybe the rule shouldn't be "you can't share screenshots" but rather "you can't ask for them."

OK. Good idea. How do we do that? Am I asking for a screenshot if I say 'you know, a screenshot would really help me trust you'? Or is 'shame we don't have a screen shot of that' asking? Or more likely, how about I say 'to cement our trust and show how trustworthy I am, I am going to send you a screenshot proving MY end of the deal...' That's not asking, is it ;)
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Re: Time for a Rules Change

Postby Custer » 29 Mar 2018, 20:44

I don't care one way or the other. I'll never ask for one, if you send one, I won't believe it. Same for messages. Don't forward them.....ever......just not good taste. And always remember..........Finalize!

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Re: Time for a Rules Change

Postby Don Juan of Austria » 29 Mar 2018, 21:14

NoPunIn10Did wrote:
Machiara wrote:I have enough on my plate without having to become an expert image editor as well.


You

Don't

Need

To.

Lying with pictures does not require you to edit images. You are more capable of doing this than you think.


You don't need to. You don't need to write people either. You don't even need to enter orders if you really don't feel like it either.

If it caught on much at all, people would necessarily need to, to keep their edge on the rest of the board.
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Re: Time for a Rules Change

Postby NoPunIn10Did » 29 Mar 2018, 21:26

Don Juan of Austria wrote:If it caught on much at all, people would necessarily need to, to keep their edge on the rest of the board.


We're not the only Diplomacy website, but they don't all have restrictions like this.

And to my knowledge, they aren't plagued by a sudden need for all their players to learn photoshop.
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Re: Time for a Rules Change

Postby Don Juan of Austria » 29 Mar 2018, 23:32

NoPunIn10Did wrote:
Don Juan of Austria wrote:If it caught on much at all, people would necessarily need to, to keep their edge on the rest of the board.


We're not the only Diplomacy website, but they don't all have restrictions like this.

And to my knowledge, they aren't plagued by a sudden need for all their players to learn photoshop.


Ah yes...another reason why we're the best Diplomacy site... :)
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